Hello everyone
Hello everyone
by Tom Servo
Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:20 pm
Hello, my name is Tom and I've been lurking here for a while!
I decided to sign up eventually after what must be over a year for a few reasons, but mostly because I just feel I'm ready to take this interest of electronic control a step further!
I'm studying for an electronic engineering degree in the UK and I think it's healthy to have a related hobby! (Although the related costs may be to my disadvantage...) My circumstances allow me access to labs, stores and many other students and teachers to learn from and talk to - I'd be crazy not to play with this!
After seeing the i-Sobot the other day on the internet I was inspired even further after seeing that although it has obvious qualities, some of which novel, some of which I could only dream of for 300USD, it lacks a true programmable feature.
My initial aim is to gain an understanding of controlling servos/outputs using 8bit micro controllers and hopefully get a biped (or whatever else that is possible) built from this foundation. I wholly accept that it will be more difficult and involved in practice, what isn't?
After that, interface sensors with the control.
My final goal would be to successfully design and make a biped with with some type of perception of it's surroundings, allowing it to navigate indoors autonomously. I'm sure the goalposts will move with time and bitter experience, maybe I have set myself too bigger challenge?
It would be lovely to be able to just buy a RN or something similar but financial restrictions (!) and the potential learning experience that is circumvented in doing so has made me think otherwise.
After reading that (phew sorry, I planned a smaller first post), does anyone have any pointers/advice/links etc they think would be useful to me?
I hope that over time and as I gain more experience with this area, I can add to the community as much as you all have.
Tom
I decided to sign up eventually after what must be over a year for a few reasons, but mostly because I just feel I'm ready to take this interest of electronic control a step further!
I'm studying for an electronic engineering degree in the UK and I think it's healthy to have a related hobby! (Although the related costs may be to my disadvantage...) My circumstances allow me access to labs, stores and many other students and teachers to learn from and talk to - I'd be crazy not to play with this!
After seeing the i-Sobot the other day on the internet I was inspired even further after seeing that although it has obvious qualities, some of which novel, some of which I could only dream of for 300USD, it lacks a true programmable feature.
My initial aim is to gain an understanding of controlling servos/outputs using 8bit micro controllers and hopefully get a biped (or whatever else that is possible) built from this foundation. I wholly accept that it will be more difficult and involved in practice, what isn't?
After that, interface sensors with the control.
My final goal would be to successfully design and make a biped with with some type of perception of it's surroundings, allowing it to navigate indoors autonomously. I'm sure the goalposts will move with time and bitter experience, maybe I have set myself too bigger challenge?
It would be lovely to be able to just buy a RN or something similar but financial restrictions (!) and the potential learning experience that is circumvented in doing so has made me think otherwise.
After reading that (phew sorry, I planned a smaller first post), does anyone have any pointers/advice/links etc they think would be useful to me?
I hope that over time and as I gain more experience with this area, I can add to the community as much as you all have.
Tom
by Robo1
Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:31 pm
I would start small. Design a 3 servo walking machine this can be a biped or some other form. Then you have a perfect starting point to design the control board and hook up some sensor. After you get it up and running You can add to it and buy more servo and work from there.
Some cool sites:
http://www.sparkfun.com/
http://gumstix.com/
http://arduino.cc/
http://openservo.com/
Bren
Some cool sites:
http://www.sparkfun.com/
http://gumstix.com/
http://arduino.cc/
http://openservo.com/
Bren
by Tom Servo
Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:55 pm
Wow thanks for the quick reply! I'm sorry if these questions are too simple for you but please believe me, I just want to learn!
How do you imagine someone carrying this out? With 3 servos, battery/PSU, micro controller and brackets?
What do you mean by control board? What is the progression from the first 3 DOF control to this one?
I have looked at the gumstix a lot, it looks capable! Do you think to start with I should start with an 8bit micro controller or just jump straight in with the gumstix?
Openservo also looks like a noble project, I have seen this before while looking on this site - awesome.
Robo1 wrote:I would start small. Design a 3 servo walking machine this can be a biped or some other form.
How do you imagine someone carrying this out? With 3 servos, battery/PSU, micro controller and brackets?
Robo1 wrote:Then you have a perfect starting point to design the control board and hook up some sensor.
What do you mean by control board? What is the progression from the first 3 DOF control to this one?
Robo1 wrote:After you get it up and running You can add to it and buy more servo and work from there.
Some cool sites:
http://www.sparkfun.com/
http://gumstix.com/
http://arduino.cc/
http://openservo.com/
Bren
I have looked at the gumstix a lot, it looks capable! Do you think to start with I should start with an 8bit micro controller or just jump straight in with the gumstix?
Openservo also looks like a noble project, I have seen this before while looking on this site - awesome.
by Robo1
Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:20 pm
How do you imagine someone carrying this out? With 3 servos, battery/PSU, micro controller and brackets?
Yes
What do you mean by control board? What is the progression from the first 3 DOF control to this one?
Some controller 8bit /gumstix that you can make the servo's move with PWm and that can read the sensors.
What do you mean by control board? What is the progression from the first 3 DOF control to this one?
I would start with the 8Bit controllers. If you haven't used linux or embedded linux then it would be a step learning curve.
Bren[/code]
by Pev
Sun Nov 04, 2007 7:55 pm
Hi Tom,
Excellent advice from Bren and I fully agree. Just to give you an idea - I started in what I think of as proper robotics (lol) a good few years ago. And I started as Bren said with a 3 DOF walker (6 legs) kit.
Not a great pic I am afraid. I still have this bot and it still works perfectly. It uses 3 ordinary analog servos and a Basic Stamp 2 (can you even still get those?). Runs on 4 AA batteries and has an IR range finder (very old one at that).
You don't have to spend vast amounts of money to have fun in robotics. I waited years to get a Biped (even unsuccessfully tried to build one) then along came the RN-1 and Bioloid. They are both a huge amount of fun (yeah I went mad and got both) but I still find myself going back to my simple ones, both tracked and legged, as they are still just as much fun.
My advice - look around at everything, walking wheeled and tracked, no legs, 2 legs and loads of legs. Find a robot that captures your imagination (I got hooked on walkers after seeing an old film called runaway with evil robot spiders) and go for it. Am sure you'll love it.
Hope this helps
Pev
Excellent advice from Bren and I fully agree. Just to give you an idea - I started in what I think of as proper robotics (lol) a good few years ago. And I started as Bren said with a 3 DOF walker (6 legs) kit.
Not a great pic I am afraid. I still have this bot and it still works perfectly. It uses 3 ordinary analog servos and a Basic Stamp 2 (can you even still get those?). Runs on 4 AA batteries and has an IR range finder (very old one at that).
You don't have to spend vast amounts of money to have fun in robotics. I waited years to get a Biped (even unsuccessfully tried to build one) then along came the RN-1 and Bioloid. They are both a huge amount of fun (yeah I went mad and got both) but I still find myself going back to my simple ones, both tracked and legged, as they are still just as much fun.
My advice - look around at everything, walking wheeled and tracked, no legs, 2 legs and loads of legs. Find a robot that captures your imagination (I got hooked on walkers after seeing an old film called runaway with evil robot spiders) and go for it. Am sure you'll love it.
Hope this helps
Pev
by Tom Servo
Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:54 pm
Cheers Pev, again, appreciated!
I don't know about the availability of the Basic Stamp 2, but I do know that the development kits are (relatively) expensive, as are the IC's - I hope someone can prove me wrong though!
I was looking at the pic16 series of IC's, and I know I'm going to be using 8051's very soon. Does anyone have any experience or advice when it comes to these?
It does help Pev, cheers!
I don't know about the availability of the Basic Stamp 2, but I do know that the development kits are (relatively) expensive, as are the IC's - I hope someone can prove me wrong though!
I was looking at the pic16 series of IC's, and I know I'm going to be using 8051's very soon. Does anyone have any experience or advice when it comes to these?
It does help Pev, cheers!
by NovaOne
Sun Nov 04, 2007 10:02 pm
Hi Tom,
Parallax (http://www.parallax.com)still make the BS2 among many others.
Available in the UK from Milford Instruments (http://www.milinst.com/index.htm)
If its very cheap PIC based controllers check out Picaxe from Revolution Education (http://www.rev-ed.co.uk/picaxe/)
A fairly cheap dev kit for PIC series micros is the PIC multiprogrammer with Flowcode 3.2 from Matrix Multimedia. which can be used to code in C or using a graphical flowchart method. http://www.matrixmultimedia.com/
Good luck
Chris
Parallax (http://www.parallax.com)still make the BS2 among many others.
Available in the UK from Milford Instruments (http://www.milinst.com/index.htm)
If its very cheap PIC based controllers check out Picaxe from Revolution Education (http://www.rev-ed.co.uk/picaxe/)
A fairly cheap dev kit for PIC series micros is the PIC multiprogrammer with Flowcode 3.2 from Matrix Multimedia. which can be used to code in C or using a graphical flowchart method. http://www.matrixmultimedia.com/
Good luck
Chris
by Pev
Sun Nov 04, 2007 11:49 pm
The last time I need a processor quickly but not overly pricey I used an MR-8 board - they have am ATMega 8 processor and all supporting hardware for about £18 including the dreaded VAT. I think processors are becoming a case of picking them by capability first then what you like second. I like the AT reange as they can be programmed with Bascom or C
Cheers
Pev
Cheers
Pev
by Robo1
Mon Nov 05, 2007 11:22 am
IF your interested I have a parallax board of education with manuals. Here USB model. That I keep on meaning to put on ebay but can never be bothered. It's a very good way of learning electronics. I've just grow out of it. I would want £40 including postage for it.
Bren
Bren
by Tom Servo
Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:41 pm
Robo1 wrote:IF your interested I have a parallax board of education with manuals. Here USB model. That I keep on meaning to put on ebay but can never be bothered. It's a very good way of learning electronics. I've just grow out of it. I would want £40 including postage for it.
Bren
Thanks Bren, that's really kind and what a saving! I'm afraid I'll have to turn it down right now though. Surely you could get more on ebay, even if the dollar is so very weak right now? (Which must also be nice to get bits from USA...)