Alternative Gripper for the RoboNova-1
Alternative Gripper for the RoboNova-1
by CaptKill4Fun
Sat Jul 15, 2006 6:00 am
Hi, I've designed some "add-on" kits for the HiTecRCD RoboNova-1 and other bots ... including a new alternative gripper kit for the RoboNova-1.
My gripper design is intended to maintain the original look of the RoboNova-1 and give the bot a thumb rather than a claw.
OTOH, other kits give the RoboNova-1 more functionality, more usefulness as well as giving the RoboNova-1 longer lasting stamina ...
Like the "BoneyFingers" kits which have fully articulated fingers ...
. . . . . . . . . . . . . .
OPEC Designs Robotic "add-on" kits for Robots ...
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Last edited by CaptKill4Fun on Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:56 pm, edited 5 times in total.
Choice of NovaGrabber Sides ...
by CaptKill4Fun
Sat Jul 15, 2006 4:54 pm
Hi, My idea is to bring more affordable kits to people who want more functionality with their robot, starting with the RoboNova-1 since I have one to work with myself.
When I read how Matt said he had 100 gripper kits made at a cost of $100 each I was thinking it must be nice to be rich ...
100 kits * $100 = $10,000
It's hard to imagine spending $10,000 to get a pair of "post production" grippers onto a robot ... taking the chance that he can recover the extra $9,900 from sales.
Figuring there are 4 brackets to each Bauer gripper kit that makes his cost average $25/bracket.
After much work and negotiation with several machine shops I've gotten the cost of my designs down to an average of about $13/bracket in quantities of 20 kits or 25 brackets/kit ... for the parts I've been designing. That's a $BIG/bracket savings ... or like on a basic gripper kit would be a total $48 savings on bracket costs.
Still, even at $13/bracket, I can't take the financial risk and have 20 kits made ... combining all the smaller "add-on" kits into one "RoboNova-1 Add-On Kit" creates a 25 bracket kit and is part of how I get the price reduced to $13/bracket ...
So now a "RoboNova-1 Add-On Kit" is: (25 Brackets * $13/Bracket) = $325/Kit ... and 20 kits cost $6,500!
I just dont' have $6,500 to spend taking a chance I may or may not sell anything out of these kits!
But still it's a deal ...
The current "RoboNova-1 Add-On Kit" includes:
Two BigFoot LiPo feet (4 Brackets for up to TP2100-2S1P size LiPo Battery Packs)
One Set of SwivelHips (10 Brackets)
One Right Hand NovaGrabbers the Finger (4 Brackets)
One Left Hand Simple NovaGrabber (3 Brackets)
One Set of Wrist Adapter Brackets (3 Brackets)
One Expanded Top Shoulder Bracket
All designed around the RoboNova-1, HSR-8498HB & HSR-65-HB Servos ...
20 kits with 25 brackest/kit = 500 brackets @ $6,500
v.
100 kits with 4 brackets/kit = 400 brackets @ $10,000
and anothr look at the cost efficiency is:
25 brackets @ $325
_4 brackets @ $100
20 buyers at about $325 each is all it takes to make this reality ... albiet, the final price and bracket count is subject to change ...
Last edited by CaptKill4Fun on Mon Sep 04, 2006 1:08 pm, edited 13 times in total.
Making the ProtoTypes 2 C if they fit ...
by CaptKill4Fun
Thu Jul 27, 2006 6:36 pm
Hi, I currently have a POB-Eye w/POB-LCD128o and POB-Proto on order ...
I plan to design more brackets for mounting this onto the RoboNova-1 too ... matching the slightly thicker body (12mm thicker) from my SwivelHips kit ...
This can increase the "RoboNova-1 AddOn Kit" price but also the bracket count ... and if I'm lucky ... maybe even reduce the cost/bracket even more!
See the POB-Eye System in the Forum Threads here ...
After evaluating a few other possible camera systems for the RoboNova-1 it seems the POB-Eye is the best solution for the price to magnify the functionality and controlled or autonomous intelligence of the RoboNova-1.
The idea is that the POB-Eye can control a lot of the RoboNova-1 moves and functions including the new hands/grippers ... maybe even see a shape and draw that shape on a piece of paper like in this video like the POB-Bots can do ... but definately the RoboNova-1 will recognize specified shapes ...
That's all up to the RoboNova-1 routines uses program in RoboBASIC ...
FYI: Primary POB-Technology web site ...
The North American Sales web site ...
Last edited by CaptKill4Fun on Fri Sep 01, 2006 7:40 pm, edited 4 times in total.
NovaGrabbers R Tested 'n Ready 4 Production ...
by CaptKill4Fun
Fri Aug 04, 2006 11:49 pm
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Last edited by CaptKill4Fun on Sun Aug 06, 2006 7:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
by hivemind
Sat Aug 05, 2006 12:25 am
I have matt's, and his work pretty well (although i am actually designing my own because i want to have fingers...) but Matt's work very well and i will use them until my design is finished, and his design has the moving joint on the outside, opposite from yours, which clearly has several advantages, even if its no quite humanlike.
I think that just switching his rotational part (ie: flipping matt's design 180 degrees) would be essentially what you have, minus the exact design of course, but keep working on it.
I think that just switching his rotational part (ie: flipping matt's design 180 degrees) would be essentially what you have, minus the exact design of course, but keep working on it.
NovaGrabbers ...
by CaptKill4Fun
Sat Aug 05, 2006 12:55 am
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Last edited by CaptKill4Fun on Sun Aug 06, 2006 7:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
by hivemind
Sat Aug 05, 2006 1:58 am
indeed.
Unfortunetly, i have also thought about the wrist idea, and i have concluded that it would probably make the robonova a lot bulkier than before, at least to have true wrist rotation, either that or you sacrifice the elbow.
So i will provide you with several views of my latest arm design, without the hand, which is staying in private eyes untill i have it fabricated, although i may talk with matt about it and his success, and perhaps talk to tempusmaster so he can have first dibs on its release, because he has been so kind about my other work (thanks!) but as of right now thats a secret-
As for CAD, most programs are fairly easy to use, it looks like sketchup is a good one, as seen in the 3d model section it looks quite nice, but i am sticking to autodesk software myself, my measured parts are down to a 10th of a mm accuracy, and i can give them plenty of tolerance with the high-strength aircraft aluminium that i will be using to fabricate parts. (unless i can find a cheaper material that has similar durability).
The above picture measures 182 mm, that is 29 mm longer than the stock robonova arm (from the shoulder)
In these two pictures you see my elbow rotation, i chose this because i feel it lets me do many more of my karate moves plus the extra servo will helps when i need to get up given all of my leg servos (ill explain this soon enough as well)
maybe this will help with your own design, i think that my elbow rotation makes up for the wrist and cuts down on being bulky
Unfortunetly, i have also thought about the wrist idea, and i have concluded that it would probably make the robonova a lot bulkier than before, at least to have true wrist rotation, either that or you sacrifice the elbow.
So i will provide you with several views of my latest arm design, without the hand, which is staying in private eyes untill i have it fabricated, although i may talk with matt about it and his success, and perhaps talk to tempusmaster so he can have first dibs on its release, because he has been so kind about my other work (thanks!) but as of right now thats a secret-
As for CAD, most programs are fairly easy to use, it looks like sketchup is a good one, as seen in the 3d model section it looks quite nice, but i am sticking to autodesk software myself, my measured parts are down to a 10th of a mm accuracy, and i can give them plenty of tolerance with the high-strength aircraft aluminium that i will be using to fabricate parts. (unless i can find a cheaper material that has similar durability).
The above picture measures 182 mm, that is 29 mm longer than the stock robonova arm (from the shoulder)
In these two pictures you see my elbow rotation, i chose this because i feel it lets me do many more of my karate moves plus the extra servo will helps when i need to get up given all of my leg servos (ill explain this soon enough as well)
maybe this will help with your own design, i think that my elbow rotation makes up for the wrist and cuts down on being bulky
Affordable Manufacturing ...
by CaptKill4Fun
Sat Aug 05, 2006 3:12 am
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Last edited by CaptKill4Fun on Sun Aug 06, 2006 7:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
by beermat
Sat Aug 05, 2006 7:02 am
CaptKill4Fun - I do notice your occasional post in here, just once in a while, occasionally, about the parts you are planning to make..... However, I think if you want people to start ordering, you're going to need a bit more than CAD representations or cardboard cutouts to convince people to order, however encouraging the parts look in theory.
I'm not sure how much a shop would charge you for a run for a single set, but I think at some point you should bite that bullet, prove to us all (and to yourself?) that you can get them manufactured, and show us a video of a Robonova wearing the finished deal. Then you'll see orders.
Matt got it done and done well, and sold a lot of them at a premium, according to the pricing you are discovering. But sold them he did, because he made them, they were cool, we drooled, and we ordered. If you prove you can do the same, at half the price...well, as they say, if you build it, they will come.
I'm not sure how much a shop would charge you for a run for a single set, but I think at some point you should bite that bullet, prove to us all (and to yourself?) that you can get them manufactured, and show us a video of a Robonova wearing the finished deal. Then you'll see orders.
Matt got it done and done well, and sold a lot of them at a premium, according to the pricing you are discovering. But sold them he did, because he made them, they were cool, we drooled, and we ordered. If you prove you can do the same, at half the price...well, as they say, if you build it, they will come.
Build it they will come?
by CaptKill4Fun
Sat Aug 05, 2006 11:24 am
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Last edited by CaptKill4Fun on Sun Aug 06, 2006 7:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Build it they will come?
by beermat
Sat Aug 05, 2006 3:13 pm
Whoa, steady on tiger! All I was doing was replying to this comment from you:
I didn't talk about getting rich or any of the other stuff you ran off with! The Robonova doesn't have enough of a customer base for you to make something that can do that for you. I was merely talking about what I think you need to do to get some orders! But, it sounds like it's going to cost you way above what you can afford to make them prior to selling them, so it seems like you're going to need 'pre-orders'; people paying for a product that doesn't exist yet, which is risky for a customer who does not know you and who has no guarantees of a refund if you don't get enough pre-orders to meet the cost.
A cardboard set doesn't quite 'prove it', either. The RN puts a lot of stresses onto its brackets. How do I know that the design of your grippers is sound? If I used your grippers to support the whole weight of my RN on a rope, for instance, how do I know your design doesn't put too much shear stresses onto the servo, or deform under the load of supporting the RN on a rope, doing the handspring move, etc? Not criticising your design at all, it looks great, but those are some of the questions that cannot be answered by anything other than videos of the RN using the real parts in the real world.
But, in your later post, it sounds as if you're also just creating the drawings 'gratis' to get a theoretical price down, and for the benefit of all the end-users, which is great, too. Just trying to get to the bottom of all your posts about all your designs and the costs you mention you would charge in all of them, to see where you are going.
So where can I download your CAD drawings?
CaptKill4Fun wrote:Now all I need is some orders to make this a real product ...
I didn't talk about getting rich or any of the other stuff you ran off with! The Robonova doesn't have enough of a customer base for you to make something that can do that for you. I was merely talking about what I think you need to do to get some orders! But, it sounds like it's going to cost you way above what you can afford to make them prior to selling them, so it seems like you're going to need 'pre-orders'; people paying for a product that doesn't exist yet, which is risky for a customer who does not know you and who has no guarantees of a refund if you don't get enough pre-orders to meet the cost.
A cardboard set doesn't quite 'prove it', either. The RN puts a lot of stresses onto its brackets. How do I know that the design of your grippers is sound? If I used your grippers to support the whole weight of my RN on a rope, for instance, how do I know your design doesn't put too much shear stresses onto the servo, or deform under the load of supporting the RN on a rope, doing the handspring move, etc? Not criticising your design at all, it looks great, but those are some of the questions that cannot be answered by anything other than videos of the RN using the real parts in the real world.
But, in your later post, it sounds as if you're also just creating the drawings 'gratis' to get a theoretical price down, and for the benefit of all the end-users, which is great, too. Just trying to get to the bottom of all your posts about all your designs and the costs you mention you would charge in all of them, to see where you are going.
So where can I download your CAD drawings?
"Only Fools 'n Horses" ...
by CaptKill4Fun
Sat Aug 05, 2006 3:46 pm
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Last edited by CaptKill4Fun on Sun Aug 06, 2006 7:09 am, edited 1 time in total.