Remote control via PC?
Remote control via PC?
by mic
Sat Jan 13, 2007 12:39 am
Hi all, As far as I know once a motion has been defined it can then be downloaded into the CM-5 and I also believed you can launch the Behaviour control program via you PC.
My question is what is the responds like when you launch a program via you PC or even wireless connection? Does it respond immediately like a (RC remote control) or delay for a few seconds?
For example if program (A) is just for walk and avoid objects, what happen if it trip over and facing to the floor, so at that time it should thinks there is some thing in front of it so it will trying to walk backward! To avoid this problem I can launch another program called (B) Getup for example, but while program (A) are still running can I do that? If this is possible what is the respond like?
To make this quetion simple, can I remote control the robot like the Kondo KHR via a PC (RS232) instead of a RC remote control unit? i.e. same responds as KHRs just like RC car.
That would be very kind of you if anyone can answer this question, Many Thanks
My question is what is the responds like when you launch a program via you PC or even wireless connection? Does it respond immediately like a (RC remote control) or delay for a few seconds?
For example if program (A) is just for walk and avoid objects, what happen if it trip over and facing to the floor, so at that time it should thinks there is some thing in front of it so it will trying to walk backward! To avoid this problem I can launch another program called (B) Getup for example, but while program (A) are still running can I do that? If this is possible what is the respond like?
To make this quetion simple, can I remote control the robot like the Kondo KHR via a PC (RS232) instead of a RC remote control unit? i.e. same responds as KHRs just like RC car.
That would be very kind of you if anyone can answer this question, Many Thanks
by billyzelsnack
Sat Jan 13, 2007 2:54 am
You can do remote control if you buy another CM5 and SX1. Once the zigbee addon shows up you'll be able to do it that way too. Maybe with a future CM5 firmware update they'll allow you to talk to the behavior programs via the normal serial cable (hint. hint. Robotis) or maybe someone else will write a replacement firmware.
Other than that you'll have to build some hardware.
Have a look at Jan's wiki..
http://www.bioloid.info/tiki/tiki-index ... =pc+serial
He mentioned in another thread that he'll be adding wifi support soon too.
Keep in mind that you'll have to write some software too.
Other than that you'll have to build some hardware.
Have a look at Jan's wiki..
http://www.bioloid.info/tiki/tiki-index ... =pc+serial
He mentioned in another thread that he'll be adding wifi support soon too.
Keep in mind that you'll have to write some software too.
by kepler
Sat Jan 13, 2007 9:19 am
Hi mic,
according to my experience responding is pretty immediate as you can see from this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMkWwJqPCOQ
In that system control goes from robot head 770 to CM-5 via Bluetooth and robot head 770 gets remote control commands from remote control 770 via WLAN connection (or over Internet connection). So there are several radio connections in series and still the response is in practice immediate.
You find detailed description here https://garage.maemo.org/docman/view.php/134/69/README.txt
and software from here https://garage.maemo.org/frs/?group_id=134&release_id=277
-kepler
according to my experience responding is pretty immediate as you can see from this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMkWwJqPCOQ
In that system control goes from robot head 770 to CM-5 via Bluetooth and robot head 770 gets remote control commands from remote control 770 via WLAN connection (or over Internet connection). So there are several radio connections in series and still the response is in practice immediate.
You find detailed description here https://garage.maemo.org/docman/view.php/134/69/README.txt
and software from here https://garage.maemo.org/frs/?group_id=134&release_id=277
-kepler
by inaki
Sat Jan 13, 2007 4:55 pm
It depends of what you consider 'immediate'. If you want to perform a close loop control using a bus connected gyro or accelerometer you may find that Bluetooth 1 is not fast enough to cope with it.
Also, although native BT 1 supports 700Kpbs, you may find that many BT serial interfaces only support 115 Kbps which is far from immediate. You might improve speed by using netowrk BT interfaces, but many of BT boards intended for embedded applications only support serial interface.
Also, although native BT 1 supports 700Kpbs, you may find that many BT serial interfaces only support 115 Kbps which is far from immediate. You might improve speed by using netowrk BT interfaces, but many of BT boards intended for embedded applications only support serial interface.
by kepler
Sat Jan 13, 2007 9:05 pm
Hi,
inaki is right, it depends what is meant by immediate. Theoretically there is not such a thing as immediate in communication.
To be more precise I just made couple of simple ping tests between two Internet tablets with WLAN connection. These tests don’t of course tell the whole story but gives idea about the order of magnitude.
Test case 1: 64 bytes packets were pinged 142 times between 2 Internet tablets which were connected with WLAN ad hoc connection to each other. So each packet was going WLAN connection twice. And results were:
Test time 141085 ms, rtt (round trip time) min/avg/max/mdev = 3.235/6.014/22.064/2.312 ms
Test case 2: 64 bytes packets were pinged 143 times between Internet tablet and access point (Linksys). So each packet was going WLAN connection twice. And results were:
Test time 142159 ms, rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 1.770/3.378/69.062/6.251 ms
Test case 3: 64 bytes packets were pinged 146 times between two Internet tablets which were connected via access point (Linksys). So each packet was going WLAN connection four times. And results were:
Test time 145021 ms, rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 3.479/5.516/46.966/3.725 ms
Surprisingly the ad hoc connection was the slowest. So is it fast enough depends fully on requirements. Bluetooth connection is slower so it will take longer time, but it also depends on packet length and used protocol what is achieved. As such radio waves transmit on speed of light in both radios
So radio connection speed always depends, it’s always far from immediate but definitely much more far from few seconds (as was asked in original question).
-kepler
inaki is right, it depends what is meant by immediate. Theoretically there is not such a thing as immediate in communication.
To be more precise I just made couple of simple ping tests between two Internet tablets with WLAN connection. These tests don’t of course tell the whole story but gives idea about the order of magnitude.
Test case 1: 64 bytes packets were pinged 142 times between 2 Internet tablets which were connected with WLAN ad hoc connection to each other. So each packet was going WLAN connection twice. And results were:
Test time 141085 ms, rtt (round trip time) min/avg/max/mdev = 3.235/6.014/22.064/2.312 ms
Test case 2: 64 bytes packets were pinged 143 times between Internet tablet and access point (Linksys). So each packet was going WLAN connection twice. And results were:
Test time 142159 ms, rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 1.770/3.378/69.062/6.251 ms
Test case 3: 64 bytes packets were pinged 146 times between two Internet tablets which were connected via access point (Linksys). So each packet was going WLAN connection four times. And results were:
Test time 145021 ms, rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 3.479/5.516/46.966/3.725 ms
Surprisingly the ad hoc connection was the slowest. So is it fast enough depends fully on requirements. Bluetooth connection is slower so it will take longer time, but it also depends on packet length and used protocol what is achieved. As such radio waves transmit on speed of light in both radios
So radio connection speed always depends, it’s always far from immediate but definitely much more far from few seconds (as was asked in original question).
-kepler
by mic
Sat Jan 13, 2007 10:05 pm
Thanks very much guys for all these useful information. Yes I would really want it to be wireless and. I think the Zig-100 should be available soon. But again Bioloid doesn’t have any remote control program available, so I would think at this present time using the 770 as a remote is a very cool idea. 
by Groover
Fri Jan 26, 2007 1:49 am
How about this module. It should be small enough to fit like the zig-100 so you dont need to put it external.
http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/produc ... cts_id=148
http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/produc ... cts_id=148
by kepler
Sat Jan 27, 2007 3:55 pm
Module that Groover proposes looks nice. http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=582
fits also inside https://garage.maemo.org/docman/view.php/134/59/Figure1.jpg. You have to cut an interior plastic wall in battery box to get the module fit and make a hole for the wires in this implementation.
-kepler
fits also inside https://garage.maemo.org/docman/view.php/134/59/Figure1.jpg. You have to cut an interior plastic wall in battery box to get the module fit and make a hole for the wires in this implementation.
-kepler
by Pev
Sat Jan 27, 2007 5:15 pm
kepler wrote:Module that Groover proposes looks nice. http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=582
fits also inside https://garage.maemo.org/docman/view.php/134/59/Figure1.jpg. You have to cut an interior plastic wall in battery box to get the module fit and make a hole for the wires in this implementation.
-kepler
Wow and I've had mine hanging about outside all this time. Think I'llhave to check this out a bit more.
Cheers
Pev
by mic
Sun Jan 28, 2007 12:26 am
kepler wrote:Module that Groover proposes looks nice. http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=582
fits also inside https://garage.maemo.org/docman/view.php/134/59/Figure1.jpg. You have to cut an interior plastic wall in battery box to get the module fit and make a hole for the wires in this implementation.
-kepler
That's cool! it really can fit inside the box.